my horse has been neglected and iguess you could say mentally abused... he was left alone in a pature with his mom without any human interaction execpt being chased by four whhelers for the first year and a half of his life. than he was taken to some other idiot who tried to saddle and ride him without any ground work while it was tranqued to get his teeth done... bad experience. so this horse is nervous around everything and hates to have a rider on its back. we desensitized him to a certain extent... i mean we can rub a plastic bag all over him, but each time we pull it out its like hes never seen it and we have to get him used to it all over again. he can load into any type of trailer well, he is ok with being tied and having his feet cleaned out and trimmed (we don't shoe him) but he won't let us bath or clip him. I can put a saddle on him and even get on him in the stall and sit there and he'll be fine, but when we lead him out to the round pen and get on, he freaks. help please!!
Horse training help needed!!!?
I'm just gonna give a couple of tips...It's hard to give advice when we can't see what the horse is doing...and when.
Please don't get on the horse in the stall, especially if he has "freak out" problems...that's an injury to you...waiting to happen.
Plastic bags...like grocery bags? I've desensitized mine to them by bringing their grain to them in the bag. I rattle it, squish it around, and let them smell it, and even eat out of it...while I'm holding it. Mine come from across the pasture if I'm carrying bags.
Bathing...begin to desensitize...just start with water on the feet and legs. Until he accepts it, and just stands there. May take more than one day to achieve this. Don't rush it. Every time he accepts the water on him...move higher.
You'll have to explain more when you say he freaks out when you get on him...while you're mounting? After you are in the saddle? When you ask him to move?
Then don't ask him to move. This is another desensitizing process. Try just mounting and sitting there. And don't tense up. Try waiting for him to move on his own. I'd be concerned that he is learning to "get rid of you" and this behavior will get worse.
Does he "whoa?" And if he does, I would mount him, sit for a minute, then get back off...while it is YOUR idea, and not HIS.
email me...
Reply:Sorry - but if you dont know what to do with a horse like this and are resulting to Y!A for the quickie... you shouldnt even have a horse like this if you dont know how to handle the situation
Reply:a horse that has been so leary of people you can start by not using the bag any more because sometimes little things affect each of us different you are winning over his trust and have reached a point where you need to go further... so take him by the lead and just take him out walk him like a dog spend time raising the trust level with no expectations and give him treats...also leave him for an afternoon in the round pen . he's not freaking in the stalls because thats were he feels most secure be safe...
Reply:He sounds like he's been through a rough patch. One thing that I've used with success with a youngster is have him loose in the pen or someone else lead him round while you ride another horse. If you have some quite tracks try riding out while leading the horse with you. Start this with another person leading while you ride beside the horse. This lets him get used to haveing someone higher than him when outside.
You don't say how long you have had the horse for and it will take time for him to forget the previous experiences and start to trust you. The other thing to try would take him right back to the start but do everything in the pen, so start getting him used to the pad and saddle and all that in the pen before you even think about trying to mount. Use a mounting block and get him used to you leaning over.
Leave the clipping and bathing for just now, you can only work on one or two things at a time and clipping isn't really a necessity.
I know you say you only took the horse on because you feel sorry for it but you also need to consider whether you have the experience to deal with the behaviour. I rescued a tb last month. He is increedible sweet and not a bad bone at all. I was riding him regularily and had been with no major issues for 3 months and then he bolted and I broke both ankles. I'm now rehoming him as I've realised I don't know enough to deal with this behaviour but he's going on loan so as I always know he is in a good home and won't be badly treated again. If you feel that this horse is outside of your experience, expecially if you haven't broken a youngster before then you need to consider if you can safely work with this horse. If you feel you can't then I would suggest rehomeing to a more experienced home. In the uk there is a wonderful website called 'project horses' that only advertise horse like this one and I would imagine there is a similar thing in the us.
If you feel you have the experience but are struggling with one or two points then consider getting a trainer to come and work with you and the horse. The other option would be to forget trying to back the horse for a year or so and just spend the time letting the horse come to trust you without anything being asked of him and then try again in a year or so.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do with your horse - if you do decide to rehome him, don't feel bad as that may be the best thing for the horse and just think, if you find a brilliant home for him he wouldn't have been there were it not for you taking him in and doing all the early work with him. :-)
Reply:sounds like you like this horse . if you have the money send him out to a trainer. why get your self hurt.
Reply:I don't wonna parrot the other good answers you've got already,
just wonna let you know that I really appreciate what you're doing for hat horse.
Just don't loose your patience with him, you know, everything bad that happened to him happened during the most important part of his life, he got afraid of humans and what they're doing, he has no clue about people not being bad all together, like an older abused horse might have seen better days before the abuse happened, so they are able to remember the better times which obviously back now, they will faster recover when put in to better conditions.
All your boy can remember is what happened since he was born, he now has to learn first that you can be trusted which will take more time.
I think too that feeding with the plastic bag is a great idea, I used to get horses used to ATV's while bringing the hay in to the fields with it.
Reply:Tricky situation. I personally would recommend the Parelli Program (PP), lead by Pat and Linda Parelli. I have been doing the PP for about 4 years now and it is amazing! One of my friend's horses went through a similar experience while growing up. There was no way we could get near her to saddle, and sometimes even halter her. But then they started the PP and everything totally did a 180! Now, this abused, neglected horse is one of the most amazing horses at our barn. Try going to www.parelli.com to get more info on that. I highly recommend it!
Good Luck to you and your horse!
Reply:i would like to add something to black bunnys training methods.i have a real heavy saddle that i use for saddle training,i took the sturrups off and i saddle them up in the round pen and start work there,after they learn to accept the saddle i will turn them out into the corral for a day(always watching).then like black bunny said you weight the saddle and step off(always shake the saddle to let the horse know you are mounting).if your horse is scared of something stop the horse and let it figure out that it wont get hurt.you will know when it has accepted it when the horse drops its head and softens its eyes,one ear will probably face whatever it is but the other ear will pivot to look for other things.i have one that never saw a human till he was 5,the rancher didnt even know he had it.we caught him and he has been with me for four years and is well versed in riding now but the first year and a half were a handfull to train him,just be patient..
edit:sorry i cant think strait right now.physical problems..but when you mount him do you leave the halter on or take it off.mine for the longest time would do great with a halter on but would freek out without it on,so i would just start him doing anything with his halter on and leave it on untill i was done,even durring the bitting process.i think he thaught of it as a safety blanket..
Reply:Maybe your horse would have been the nervous type even without the terrible start.
It's obviously not a short term fix you need or are likely to get.
It's going to take a long time for your horse to be anything like 'other' horses.
If you've broken other horses and they've turned out ok then you should know what you're doing. In the U.K. we wouldn't back a horse without long reining first, but I expect you've already done that.
I would recommend that you stop putting so much pressure on him, why keep bringing out the plastic bag? I understand what you are trying to do but it's obviously an issue to him and he doesn't appear to be learning from it.
If you are genuinely experienced with horses then I suspect you would have already tried pretty much everything, but other than get into a discussion on breaking and schooling, I suggest you try a herbal calmer first, Dodson and Horrells Placid is good and only works on genuinely nervous or stressy horses, not on naughty ones.
Give it a try for a few weeks, and if you have him stabled give him a break and turn him away with good company.
Reply:Wow, very good answers. I would like to ad to have his back checked for physical issues. If he were mine....I would hand walk him and work him on trust issues and get his confidence boosted. Praised the heck out of him when he is a "brave boy". Lots of rubs and kind soft words. You need to reassure him that you will not hurt him and are only looking out for his best interest. Good luck and stay safe.
Reply:Every horse is different, and this one sounds like he needs time to adjust.
Does he buck with the saddle? Or freak out with the saddle at all? Or is it just when you get on? Have you tried leaning over his back without the saddle? Have you tried bareback? Sometimes it's less scary, and if he starts to freak, you can slide off quickly. Just a thought.
It sounds like you've tried everything, and that you know what you're doing. Ponying him with the saddle on should help.
Is he a real hard bucker? Or just spooks and runs? Because I think you can deal with a spooky horse, but a horse that has the instinct to always buck might be a better pasture ornament. If he runs, see if you can work on getting him to really flex laterally, so you can bend his head around to the side, and work on getting him to turn in a circle when you get on. If you can stay on, and just keep him in a circle, his hips will be disengaged, he can't run. But if he's a hard bucker, it's a different story--he'll do whatever he feels like.
I hope you have success with this horse, as much time and effort that you've already invested in him. I know a good trainer I would recommend to you. He isn't one of the big names (I grew up down the road from him) but he really knows a horse's mind and how to help it through tough times like this. He worked with Tom Dorrance, years ago, and has really been a help to me. I call him all the time, if I have a horse problem. Email me if you want his contact information. I know he takes outside horses, and if you're seriously in need of help, he's the first person I'd ask.
Good luck. You've got some great answers above!
Reply:i think its great that you took in a "mentally abused" horse. What do you mean plastic bag? any way be calm around him get him used to wearing the saddle maybe put a bag of flour on his back while you walk him to get him used to the weight read John Leons magazine if you can send me more info ive trained five horses on my own and have helped with many more
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