Horse experts - help!!!!!?

Ive got a 15.1hh irish horse - i loev him to bits but i just can't hold him - ive been at my new yard now for 2years and the grass there is better than he's had anywhere before - ive fenced the paddock off so that he's got less grass, stopped feeding him , teeth , back done! He's always been strong and danced about and i do find it fun only i hate it when i'm trying to warm up before jumping he gets so excited that he will throw his head up or down to get away from my hand so he can just go! When i'm actually in the ring at a show he's fine - its just at home ! I've tried all the different bits the best one was a Wilkie bit - but i cant find a horse one of these! Any suggestions:

Horse experts - help!!!!!?
He is having fun! You seem a kind competent rider who he trusts. So he throws his head about in the practice ring? So? As long as he is not smashing you in the face and behaving well in the ring and bringing in the results you deserve....so what!





Sod the harsher bits, draw reins etc...he is 15, had a tough life and seems to me he is just happy to be there with you!





Suggest you work him well on the flat away from the bustle of the arenas for 20 mins then pop him over one fence in the practice ring and away for a quiet walk for 5 mins before entering the ring. Relax and enjoy the fun!
Reply:I'd just like to say that I wasn't implying that YOU are a bad rider. The fact is that I have seen a lot of bad riders who just put a stronger bit on their horses rather than make the effort to learn to ride better! I find those people frustrating, not you! Report It

Reply:i had a horse a few yrs back that behaved in exactly the same way. i put him in a stage 3 long shank myler bit it worked a treat and the myler bits are not hard in their mouths they work from a poll action they really do work but they are very expensive to buy, but, worth every single penny.
Reply:If you've had his back, teeth, etc checked and cut down on his feed then the only thing left to suggest is working him more! He sounds excitable rather than in pain or being plain old nasty.





Have you lunged before? It may be an idea to lunge him for 15/20 minutes before you get on him, just to take the edge off him.





Also, try varying his routine. If you jump and school him every day he may be getting bored. Try a change of scenery, take him on a hack or even a beach ride (if you have one fairly near by!) every now and then. You can even try loose schooling, it's great fun and something different for him.





I'd much rather you didn't use a severe bit to try and control him, it's much better for him (and you) to strengthen your riding and give him more work to do. Too many people just stick in a harsh bit to cover up for their own poor riding skills.
Reply:This horse knows just how much it can get away with. He has little respect for you, and is demonstrating this well with his behaviour. You need to find a competent instructor to teach you techniques, on the ground, to gain your horses trust and respect. Just because he has an excitable nature, it is no excuse for you allowing him to walk all over you. By inflicting stronger mechanical devices on your horse, in order to control him, you are further breaking the bond of trust. There are ways and means out there to turn the relationship you have with your horse into a partnership.


Check out this link:


http://www.parelli.com/
Reply:I have used Uxeter bits with most of my horses. It's not a harsh bit at all and the horses seem to respond well to it. I have a Standardbred I use this bit on now and he responds much better to this then he did with a snaffle. I think the joint was pinching him as he likes to play with the bits. I also put him in a different bridle with the flash noseband to help eliminate his head tossing when he was playing with the bit (he figured out he can't open his mouth now so he stopped the sudden head movements). Also try more groundwork, try free-lunging, etc. And when you get on-don't just let him take off, if he starts acting up make circles, make him stand, don't let him get away with running off on you. There are tons of books and magazines that can offer great advice for riders. There is a lot you can do, you need to investigate and try things, it will be mostly trial-and-error until you figure out what works for you and your horse, but if you inquire about the problems you have with him with horse-people at your barn or in your area, I am sure many will offer their advice or offer to take a look at him. Most horse people are kind and always willing to help if they can.


I hope this helps you! Good Luck!!
Reply:i have a horse who behaves similar i have him in a german hackamore. because of his jaw alignment he is very awkward in a nomal bit i am thinking of trying him in happy mouth pelham. anyway back to you. as you have had his back etc checked it doesnt seem medical just that he larking about and atleast he is ok in the ring. i have pretty much restarted my horse from the beginning it may seem boring but you can work through any little problems as they arise because i bet you he probably has other niggly problems on the ground or whatever that you maybe let him get away with. dont be harsh just start from the beginning and take it step by step.anyway i hope you get on ok so good luck
Reply:well if you have everything else checked then its going to be down to the tack. I presume you're using a martingale?


I too have an excitable mare and whilst I know you dont want to go harsh bits- I find shes a dream to ride in a rubber pelham - its not too harsh - particularly with a rubber slip over the curb chain.


Also - could i suggest you try riding him in draw reins- they give that extra bit of force on the head making him work off the bit - which a lot of the time horses tend to throw their heads around when being ridden in these


If you havent used them before - it might help to have an instructor around - if you pull them too tightyou will make it uncomfortable for your horse and make him overbend.


Good luck


xx
Reply:my girl was just like that. she jumped and danced, she was not a dream to ride. i tired everything from harsher bits to vet appointments but the only thing that worked was these dvds i order from monty robets.





he's a gentle horse trainer and after putting his tips into practice i have a sweet lovable girl. on these dvd's he shows how to use a horses natural body language to become the top horse in your horse's mind. a horse follows and listens to it's leader, if you become that for your horse he'll follow you and do what you ask. the dvd's aren't cheap but they helped me get my girl under control.
Reply:There are alot of herbal remedies around that could help your horse. They take a couple of weeks to start taking effect but often the results are amazing. Try looking them up online, it can take a while to find the right one for your horse, and they dont always help. Good Luck
Reply:Is he a stallion or a gelding? Just interested. Anyway, if you have an indoor school, chase him around it for 10 minutes before you get on....really make him canter about. I do this with my gelding but only on a day after he has had a day off or if I haven't been able to turn him out the previous day. He leaps and bucks about and it certainly gets the "bumps" out! Then he is an angel when I get on. Good luck. I agree with you wanting to avoid a stronger bit.
Reply:You may want to try this website and halter. I have used them myself on hard to handle horses and with consistant commands it helped solve me being jerked around by my horses. Hope this helps!





http://www.horseweb-uk.com/features/beni...
Reply:Firstly maybe you can get a trainer in to help you out. Secondly I'm not too sure about the bit but you say he throws his head up and down so I thought that maybe a martingale would help. Also check his diet with a profressional. Also its great that you guys have a good bond. Maybe try some t-touch etc.
Reply:If he is being difficult on the ground, use a lead rope with a chain section. Put the chain through one sideof the halter, over the nose and through the other side of the halter and clip it as usual. When he is being excitable, pull firmly on the lead to correct him.





To warm him up, try lunging him first. If he is tacked, you can do this safely by making sure the stirrups are up, and then running the reins underneath the stirrups so that they won't be flopping all over the place. Have him walk (make sure he is warmed up before other gaits!), trot, and canter both directions. This helps him to get his head into the game and focus on what you want him to do.





For riding, get a martingale. A standing martingale hooks up to the nosepiece of the bridle and will prevent him from lifting his head too high. A running martingale also works, but I don't think it is quite as effective.





Another option is sidereins. These connect at the bit and connect back to the saddle. They are adjustable, so you can set where you want his head. Introduce these slowly. Start just using them on the lunge line, fairly loose. As he gets used to them, gradually tighten them up. These will keep him from tossing his head, but will also help him to be more balanced.





Good luck! It is always nice to have a good connection with a horse!
Reply:Have you tried giving him some calming paste about 30 to 40 minutes before you ride him? It doesn't do anything to the mind, but it relaxes them so they are more manageable.
Reply:I would definately recommend a Myler bit as someone else has already suggested.





Other than that, you already longe before you ride, but is your horse turned out before you ride? This could help burn up some extra energy, but still longe before you ride. Since he's only doing the head tossing and annoying stuff while you're warming up, it may just be his way of getting his fidgets out and it may just be something you'll have to ride through every time.





My 4yo off the track thoroughbred goes through her fidgets even though she's turned out before hand and she's longed for 10 minutes before I mount. I still have to get through an additional 10 minutes of fidgets at the trot before I've got her mind focused on me and ready to work. She knows what buttons to push to aggrevate me and she knows how long it takes to tire me out. This is her way of playing with me and having a little bit of fun before she gets down to business. Now, those buttons don't work anymore and I'm getting more endurance in the saddle to out last her play.





At this point, I do not know if she'll ever out grow it, but I'm prepared to have and keep a horse that will always need longe time and fidget time before getting down to the work at hand.





If your horse is doing it only when you're warming up over small jumps, you may have a hole in your jump training. His excitment is anticipation which can cause accidents. What does your trainer think? If you don't have a trainer, you need one not because you know a lot, like the last trainer told you, but so you can bounce ideas off of them and get a different perspective for training issues, like you're having here. Every rider needs a peer to peer discussion group/circle of friends.





What I would do is go back to warming up over singles. Start at the trot and do not let him canter over the small jump. Stop immediately after the jump. If he canters and ignores your hand over the jump, immediately stop and stand for a second, then turn him and try it at the trot again. If he starts getting strong, immediately haul him back to a stop. Even if you're one stride from the fence, when he stops, make him jump from where he's at. If you're at the base of the jump, jump it from a stand still. If you're three strides from the jump, try to jump it again at the trot. Make him stop if he gets strong again.





Keep doing this until he's relaxed and listening to you. Don't go any higher and don't go any faster until he's relaxed and listening to you at the trot. Each training session over fences should begin at the trot to calm and relax your horse. When you finally get to cantering the jumps, the moment he ignores your whoa's or tosses his head, bring him back to the trot and trotting small jumps. He'll eventually catch on that every time he throws his head or ignores your hand, you go back to simple trotting which is hard work. Unfortunately, it's hard work for both of you.





Good luck!





~Jenn
Reply:One thing no one has mentioned is his diet! Have you checked his feed and hay rations? You may have your horse on the wrong feed and that may contribute to his anxious behavior. Depending on what you are feeding him- it may have to much iron or protein in it and be giving him extra energy.


You mentioned that you stopped feeding him- if you are going to be working him then you need to feed him a balanced diet that helps him perform his best. Underfeeding will make your horse just as anxious as if you were overfeeding or feeding the wrong type of feed.





Next- take him back to basics. But him in a snaffle bit and get his respect back. Some people suggested a harsher bit- the truth is it may not be a bit problem rather than a respect issue which I suspect it is. Just because a horse loves you, does not mean hes going to respect you and vice versa. Go back to the basic smooth snaffle, no horse should progress to another bit unless they've perfected themselves in the snaffle. The snaffle is the easiest bit on a horses mouth, if you don't have control and suppleness with this bit, then you won't with any other.


Stay away from contraptions such as draw reins, martingales, tie downs, etc as most people use these tools as a crutch. When the tool is removed most horses go back to the same behavior displayed before.

asp